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szimbler

1and1 being blocked, again...

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My mail provider 1and1 has been blocked several times in the last year. Every time it takes days to sort out, and I am losing potential customers.

Is there anything I can be asking 1and1 to do to sort this out? I have bullied them and email them and phoned them, but nothing seems to change. Otherwise, I just don't know what to do. Does Gmail, yahoo or Hotmail get blocked in the same way? I would have thought there would be more spammers using the big boys than companies like 1and1?

Is there anywhere I can put my mail servers where they won't get blocked? maybe I should move my mail to gmail...I can't go on like this, that is for sure.

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My mail provider 1and1 has been blocked several times in the last year. Every time it takes days to sort out, and I am losing potential customers.

Is there anything I can be asking 1and1 to do to sort this out? I have bullied them and email them and phoned them, but nothing seems to change. Otherwise, I just don't know what to do. Does Gmail, yahoo or Hotmail get blocked in the same way? I would have thought there would be more spammers using the big boys than companies like 1and1?

Is there anywhere I can put my mail servers where they won't get blocked? maybe I should move my mail to gmail...I can't go on like this, that is for sure.

Hi, sorry to hear about your troubles. Could you please post an entire and un-munged recent rejection notice?

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Hi, sorry to hear about your troubles. Could you please post an entire and un-munged recent rejection notice?

No problem, I have dozens! All I've done is replaced the sender's email address with xxxxx[at]xxxxx.xx and my address with yyy[at]yyyyyy.yyy:

From: Mail Delivery System <mailer-daemon[at]perfora.net>

Subject: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender

This message was created automatically by mail delivery software.

A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its recipients. The following addresses failed:

<xxxxx[at]xxxxx.xx>

SMTP error from remote server after MAIL command:

host mail.mbe.it[62.97.115.94]:

554 5.7.1 Service unavailable; Client host [74.208.4.194] blocked using bl.spamcop.net; Blocked - see http://www.spamcop.net/bl.shtml?74.208.4.194

--- The header of the original message is following. ---

Received: from SimonsOfficePC (pppoe99-111-static.112-217.dtssi.net [217.112.111.99])

by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrus3) with ESMTP (Nemesis)

id 0Luwzx-1VXtSD15mr-00zhi7; Tue, 12 Nov 2013 05:23:23 -0500

Reply-To: <yyy[at]yyyyyy.yyy>

From: "Simon Zimbler" <yyy[at]yyyyyy.yyy>

To: "'MBE 631'" <xxxxx[at]xxxxx.xx>

References: <019001cedac9$1bc41500$534c3f00$[at]patrignone.com> <009e01cedf84$50f00f30$f2d02d90$[at]it>

In-Reply-To: <009e01cedf84$50f00f30$f2d02d90$[at]it>

Subject: RE: !!!

Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 11:23:18 +0100

Organization: Podere Patrignone - www.patrignone.com

Message-ID: <002101cedf91$3669abf0$a33d03d0$[at]patrignone.com>

MIME-Version: 1.0

Content-Type: multipart/related;

boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0022_01CEDF99.9830FA20"

X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 15.0

Thread-index: AQG8r4txgb6LDfAtiHVHXpqx8LHgAALAgmXnmi++VSA=

Content-Language: en-gb

X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 131111-0, 11/11/2013), Outbound message

X-Antivirus-Status: Clean

X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:yGM0LfdBY00yEifWWpH8Tz1czpANy/YJrMdcRKaLVwK

oXyq9cYQoB800e23kKyAraYEvRxSTtrF6ExIVYSIfqXJjNmNo+

dVzCPgIl+5TfN2Qyi9ALiO6vtEYYOy10gmnm2rM6ntJndWgu2B

xLjfOWZSy7+GKlBNHjrG+YZpvbcW9CemEdMAAprrfZX8uxQkAm

61Dj4RWFfgAtNxuhRiKAjAfxxhffp2SFLlNpsufs5ZlyoU/9lo

qPdkLhjhGXdsrXr9fVGaOxW5P+kH8bYc418iSmcTCf5h+UOkjP

0hlqnq87GJtuAKBIK0bXXCmAj3UqlbdvgU2jwH0MOaavoMJ3Jr

gz0gwP3wW/0kNVXr847lh7KrmM+fB9P0Er7GFg9O2i/DuGURRy

zg/q4CD8ThNVA==

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554 5.7.1 Service unavailable; Client host [74.208.4.194] blocked using bl.spamcop.net; Blocked - see http://www.spamcop.net/bl.shtml?74.208.4.194

Thanks. That seems to be a genuine and well-deserved listing :(

1&1 are being sent reports and are doing nothing about the spew of spam from that server (except requesting de-listing without fixing the problem). You are simply not getting the service that you are (I presume) paying good money for. Take your money elsewhere.

To answer your original question, gmail and hotmail servers do get listed from time to time but there are a lot of them so the chances of your mail going out through a listed server are reduced. Also they respond to reports and kick the zombied machines off their systems.

As for losing business, it is a mantra round here that email is not a guaranteed delivery method and no-one should rely on it entirely. You might wish to investigate getting your recipients to whitelist you?

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Thanks. That seems to be a genuine and well-deserved listing :(

1&1 are being sent reports and are doing nothing about the spew of spam from that server (except requesting de-listing without fixing the problem). You are simply not getting the service that you are (I presume) paying good money for. Take your money elsewhere.

To answer your original question, gmail and hotmail servers do get listed from time to time but there are a lot of them so the chances of your mail going out through a listed server are reduced. Also they respond to reports and kick the zombied machines off their systems.

As for losing business, it is a mantra round here that email is not a guaranteed delivery method and no-one should rely on it entirely. You might wish to investigate getting your recipients to whitelist you?

I thought as much. My website is hosted with 1and1 so I'll probably keep that there, but I'll move my mail servers somewhere more reliable. Thank you for the explanation. It's very useful and means I can take some positive action.

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I thought as much. My website is hosted with 1and1 so I'll probably keep that there, but I'll move my mail servers somewhere more reliable. Thank you for the explanation. It's very useful and means I can take some positive action.

You might want to look at JustHost. I've been been with them for over three years now and only once have I received a rejection notice. Their response was immediate and effective :) They'll make transferring in pretty painless.

I have no commercial interest, I am just a happy customer.

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You might want to look at JustHost. I've been been with them for over three years now and only once have I received a rejection notice. Their response was immediate and effective :) They'll make transferring in pretty painless.

I have no commercial interest, I am just a happy customer.

I'll look into it...any other suggestions?

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The 1&1 SMTP relay is blocked, that blocks all incoming email of 1&1 customers that choose a different email provider and use forwarding.

What is the reason to block it?

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<snip>

What is the reason to block it?

...S_pam has been seen coming from the IP address. If you know the IP address of the relay, you can get a bit more information about it here: http://www.spamcop.net/bl.shtml. If the listing is based on SpamCop user reports, a knowledgeable SpamCop paying user can give you more details if you will provide the relay IP address here. However, listings are often caused by sending spam to SpamCop spam Traps, about which we here have no information; you would have to contact the SpamCop Deputies at deputies[at]admin.spamcop.net and they will provide only very basic information and, if I understand correctly, only to those who can demonstrate an administrative responsibility for the IP address in question.

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Derek T,

Having been hosted with 1and1 for many years; I truly doubt the veracity of your statement that "1&1 are being sent reports and are doing nothing about the spew of spam from that server (except requesting de-listing without fixing the problem).".

Given their size I also imagine it takes some time to close down the "customer". In the meantime 10's of thousands of users are blocked from performing legitimate business.

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Hi, SteveS,

<snip>Given their size I also imagine it takes some time to close down the "customer".
...The larger a provider, the more resources I would expect them to have and therefore the more effective they should be at identifying and stopping spammers operating on their network.
10's of thousands of users are blocked from performing legitimate business.
...You may wish to direct your complaint to the entities who are actually doing the blocking -- e-mail admins who are using the SpamCop (and perhaps other) blacklist to block, instead of tag or deliver to a "suspected spam" folder, e-mails from spam sources. Be prepared to meet with resistance or silence -- it's their e-mail networks and therefore their right to do whatever they want with incoming mail and only their own customers are likely to have any leverage and then only if they (the customers) vote their wishes by taking their dollars elsewhere.

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Given their throughput, member reports alone (1-7 a day lately on 74.208.4.194 for instance) are probably never going to get those major servers listed - the problem, presumably, is they keep hitting one or more spamtraps and those carry great weight in the listing equation but are never reported.

1and1 may need to liaise with the SC deputies on that - they may be able to get the message subject(s) and approximate timing to verify that those spamtrap hits are part of spam runs which are also the subject of member reports. If so, well and good, normal tidying up of errant/compromised accounts on the basis of the very comprehensive evidence provided by member reports will help them remove those and they will delist automatically. If not, they need to do some serious detecting.

I'm sure 1and1 know all that but, since they've not been effective in stemming the flow, have lacked the will and/or incentive to get serious about it. At heart, that is their business decision. The SCbl users (networks) who are doing all this blocking on the basis of the list are also making business decisions.

Yes, it seems terribly unfair on all those innocents who are affected but that's the way it is. The ultimate alternative to the continuing war on spam (of which SC is just another combatant, facilitating one part of the armour) is wall-to-wall spam. Ð…pam accounts for at least 85% of all e-mail traffic between networks, with an unknown additional amount intercepted during the outgoing transit. Keeping most of that out of in-boxes by whatever means - but efficiency demands it be stemmed as close as possible to the source - is all that keeps the e-mail messaging service mostly viable most of the time.

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