This is a terrible mess

[WangVS 0]

I got an email about the new "mail host" thing. I followed the instructions. Since then nothing has made sense. I can't navigate from the Web pages to anything connected with the mail host thing, can't find the list of mail hosts you are talking about, and if I follow the link in the second email and paste a spam message into the box it complains that there is no cookie. I log in and it tells me something like "unknown action." This seems like a real mess.

As someone concerned about spam and willing to submit or file 100-200 confirmed spam message per day, I am willing to go to a little trouble to do it but not this. I'm going to have to stop reporting spam to SpamCop.

[Wazoo 0]

Not sure what to tell you ... Almost 500 postings in this Forum, and most of the "special" issue conversations have ended up with instructions to e-mail a certain address. One of the major, critical Pinned items include the words "please read before posting" .. (I know because I put those words there) .. and these Pinned Items also include some e-mail instructions.

As the problems you seem to be having have never been posted by anyone else, I'd say that this makes your situation very unique, therefore especially meeting the guidelines of needing to follow the "e-mail" instructions. As some one willing to help out someone with issues and am willing to type in hundreds of keystrokes a day, I am willing to go to a little trouble, but ..... I think that someone who barges in, jumps right over all those words typed in before to offer a starting point, and just drops a load of attitude on my screen .. well, I'm going to stop typing right about now.

[turetzsr 0]

Hi, WangVS,

...Here's the post to which Wazoo is referring: Pinned: Mailhost Issues - please read before posting .

[WangVS 0]

Not sure what to tell you ... Almost 500 postings in this Forum, and most of the "special" issue conversations have ended up with instructions to e-mail a certain address.  One of the major, critical Pinned items include the words "please read before posting" .. (I know because I put those words there) .. and these Pinned Items also include some e-mail instructions. 

As the problems you seem to be having have never been posted by anyone else, I'd say that this makes your situation very unique, therefore especially meeting the guidelines of needing to follow the "e-mail" instructions.  As some one willing to help out someone with issues and am willing to type in hundreds of keystrokes a day, I am willing to go to a little trouble, but .....  I think that someone who barges in, jumps right over all those words typed in before to offer a starting point, and just drops a load of attitude on my screen .. well, I'm going to stop typing right about now.

Wazoo:

Somehow I'm not at all surprised by your response. I guess all this SpamCop and especially the new mail hosts stuff is just not for really technical people. There's something very nonintuitive about it that seems to be perfectly OK with nontechnical people. I've been designing and writing software for 40 years and have been active in development of Internet software since the Internet became available to the public. I developed a Web server for a mainframe manufacturer, I run my own servers, etc., etc. If I have trouble understanding what SpamCop is doing and requesting of us, it's SpamCop's problem, not mine.

Your response helped me make my decision. I have better things to do. I won't be reporting spam to SpamCop anymore nor contributing any more money.

Have a nice life.

[turetzsr 0]

<snip>

I guess all this SpamCop and especially the new mail hosts stuff is just not for really technical people.  There's something very nonintuitive about it that seems to be perfectly OK with nontechnical people.  I've been designing and writing software for 40 years and have been active in development of Internet software since the Internet became available to the public.  I developed a Web server for a mainframe manufacturer, I run my own servers, etc., etc.  If I have trouble understanding what SpamCop is doing and requesting of us, it's SpamCop's problem, not mine.

<snip>

...My situation is not much different from yours. I have a good deal of IT experience but I don't understand how this Mailhosts thing works at all. However, I followed the instructions as best I could and after a couple of false starts and reports back to deputies (as requested in the above-cited pinned message and its predecessors) it finally worked.

...Please don't give up until you've exhausted the resources available that aren't too much of a burden to you.

[Ellen 0]

I got an email about the new "mail host" thing.  I followed the instructions.  Since then nothing has made sense.  I can't navigate from the Web pages to anything connected with the mail host thing, can't find the list of mail hosts you are talking about, and if I follow the link in the second email and paste a spam message into the box it complains that there is no cookie.  I log in and it tells me something like "unknown action."  This seems like a real mess.

As someone concerned about spam and willing to submit or file 100-200 confirmed spam message per day, I am willing to go to a little trouble to do it but not this.  I'm going to have to stop reporting spam to SpamCop.

I suspect that there is more than one problem here as the mailhosts should not prevent navigation on the website. How about sending me copies of all the emails that you received as well as your registered SC email address and let's see if we can't get it straigtened out.

[Spamnophobic 0]

I can't navigate from the Web pages to anything connected with the mail host thing,

It may be that WangVS's problem is that the webmail page doesn't include any direct help on the mailhosts thing, or a direct link like a "configure my mailhosts" button. In the first instance that would seem to me to be a good idea. But there may be security complications to that. Remember spammers, hackers, etc. follow developments at SpamCop with great interest too. In fact this may be the reason for the generally rather diffuse nature of technical help with SpamCop!

and if I follow the link in the second email and paste a spam message into the box

Into the box in the link from the SpamCop account configuration e-mail should go that message itself, not a spam!

.. (I know because I put those words there) ..

Wazoo, as far as I can see this pinned item is from Ellen. Can I therefore conclude that Wazoo and Ellen are the same person ?

Seriously though, a pity to see tempers getting frayed. I understand WangVS's feelings, I endorse Ellen's conciliatory approach and I hope WangVS doesn't leave, after all.

I'm having a fine old time with mailhosts too, but after careful perusal of this section of the forum I think I now understand what I need to do. That is report some spam manually, then mail the deputies with a request to turn quick reporting back on. If I understand it correctly, the main purpose of the mailhosts thing is to stop us accidentally quickly reporting our own ISPs as spam-facilitators, and that seems to me to be a very good idea.

[Wazoo 0]

Wazoo, as far as I can see this pinned item is from Ellen. Can I therefore conclude that Wazoo and Ellen are the same person  ?

Ellen will hurt you when she sees this, no doubt <g>

Due to one poster's issues, I had put the "read this first" as the "remarks" so it showed under the Topic Title .... a few minutes later, Ellen say the same "issue" and went back and changed the Title, so it also included these words .... so "read this before posting" is just too danged obvious to sort out why some one "won't" read if before posting .... I keep seeing the "hard to navigate" and I can't figure that one out, especially in a case like this one ...

There's only one Forum section with Mail-Host in the title. I take credit for bugging JT enough that he bugged Julian enough that this single Topic was given its own Section, then I spent a number of days dividing up the 300+ post chain into different Topics to help isolate the various issues.

There's all the Pinned items with Titles in Bold -- so even going to the extreme of a visually handicapped browser using a reader to vocalize will "see" the "read this first" clue.

Clicking on a Topic title or two should offer enough of a clue as to the flow of one person posting, then someone else posting about what the first poster said ... and even if it wasn't about "your" specific problem, I'd think that there's enough of a clue pattern to figure out what to try next.

That this particular user, later presenting credentials as a long time expert, managed to run into problems in each and every step of the process, and then bellyache about his problems, obviously without expending any time at all to waste time "read this before posting" .... well, yeah, I responded a bit in kind. Not helping at the time was discovering that removing a long unused trial installation of ZoneAlarm by the "normal / standard" Add/Remove programs under the control panel trashes one's system (later finding that this is a well-documented "feature" on the ZoneLab support boards) So, I was already in a fine mood, just trying to get my system up and running well enough to even make it to these Forums, then to walk into that post ....

See, there is a way to ask for help, beg for guidance, etc. .... but let me point out that poster's ending remark in the very first post ...

I'm going to have to stop reporting spam to SpamCop

I didn't happen to see the words "help me" in there anywhere.