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Does anyone else have a problem with SpamCop listing IP addresses without any proof of spam originating from those IP's Especially where a shared IP is used by numerous different clients?

While I hate spam as much as the next guy, this is throwing the baby out with the bathwater in that many of my clients complain of legitimate mail bouncing because of SpamCop lists. Despite requests, no one at spam Cop has ever delivered to my company a single spam complaint to identify a domain name associated with junk emails. We shut down spammers if we are notified but this blocking of entier groups of innocent domain users without so much as a note to us is going to kill SpamCop eventually. They may soon need to use their defense fund to protect them from themselves if they don't clean up their act and start to notify hosting companies of offenders and cease blocking shared IP.

I have started to notify all of my clients of SpamCop and suggested they notify them directly anytime their legitimate emails are blocked. Also asked my clients to contact the recipients and suggest they stop using SpamCop lists until they are cleared up and the notification problems is resolved.

I have paid for SpamCop services for a number of years and agree with the objective but the cure is starting to be worse than the actual problem when legitimate business people cannot send important emails...people who never sent spam in their life.

If anyone has similar problems please share. We need spamcop but it has to be done right.

Paul

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evolutionwebinc.com,Mar 10 2005, 04:05 PM]Does anyone else have a problem with SpamCop listing IP addresses without any proof of spam originating from those IP's Especially where a shared IP is used by numerous different clients?.... [snip]

I have paid for SpamCop services for a number of years and agree with the objective but the cure is starting to be worse than the actual problem when legitimate business people cannot send important emails...people who never sent spam in their life.

25256[/snapback]

Hi Paul!

Since you are a paid up user of SpamCop you will know, I presume, how the SpamCop BL gather its information. A combination of user reports and items sent to so called spam traps.

You will also have seen, I'm sure, the reports that ISPs generate which typically identify the IP address of the offending originating server. You should be able to go straight to the blocklist the moment you get a report and check the listing which generally provides an indication of the type of spam being generated.

You'll also be aware that the SpamCop specifically encourages ISPs not to block mail on the basis of the BL but to filter mail. However, many, many ISPs choose to block because it saves them bandwidth and it has proved effective in keeping junk out of their systems. We filter our incoming mail for a dozen different domains and find the SpamCop BL to be effective especially combined with a number of other blocklists and SpamAssassin. Because we filter, rather than block, I can say with certainty that we rarely trap legitimate Email - perhaps 1 or 2 a month at most and these are invariably caught by SpamAssassin rather than the SpamCop BL.

The only time I have problems sending mail is when I send through a large, public ISP and very occasionally they get a user who is insecure and gets infected with a worm. Then their server gets listed but it generally gets cleared up very speedily precisely because the SpamCop BL reports speedily identify the problem.

Is it a perfect system? No. But it does OK for me.

I suspect you have a specific issue which has caused you to put fingers to keyboard. You might find more help if you provide the IP address concerned so those with the ability to assist can offer a more informed response.

Andrew

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Does anyone else have a problem with SpamCop listing IP addresses without any proof of spam originating from those IP's Especially where a shared IP is used by numerous different clients?

There is always proof of spam coming from any IP listed. IP's are only put on the list after hitting a threshhold number of user spam reports or spamtrap hits.

Despite requests, no one at spam Cop has ever delivered to my company a single spam complaint to identify a domain name associated with junk emails.

First of all, domain names have NOTHING to do with it, only IP addresses. If you are not authorized to receive reports for your IP address, you will not get them. The last thing users of spamcop want is the spammer to get their reports which will help them whitelist the complainers.

You have not indicated what IP address you believe to be blocked. If evolutionwebinc.com is the domain you are talking about and your outging mail travels from the same IP as your MX records indicate (69.20.21.100) then all reports go to:

Parsing input: 69.20.21.100

host 69.20.21.100 (getting name) no name

Routing details for 69.20.21.100

Cached whois for 69.20.21.100 : abuse[at]rackspace.com

Using abuse net on abuse[at]rackspace.com

abuse net rackspace.com = abuse[at]rackspace.com

Using best contacts abuse[at]rackspace.com

That IP address is not listed and has "No recent reports, no history available"

Again, mention the IP address you believe to have been blocked and we can get into specifics about what is going on. Many recent listings have been caused by hosts delivering non-deliverable messages to forged email addresses of innocent victims or spamtraps rather than rejecting the message during the SMTP transaction.

BTW, threats of "Legal action" are enough go get you listed on at least several of the personal blocklists of mail administrators who frequent here.

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/snip

BTW, threats of "Legal action" are enough go get you listed on at least several of the personal blocklists of mail administrators who frequent here.

25258[/snapback]

...not to mention it will get you on my muntchkin troll list!

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evolutionwebinc.com,Mar 10 2005, 04:05 PM]Does anyone else have a problem with SpamCop listing IP addresses without any proof of spam originating from those IP's Especially where a shared IP is used by numerous different clients?

If anyone has similar problems please share.  We need spamcop but it has to be done right.

Paul

25256[/snapback]

No problem for me. SpamCop is alway's perfect and of course the very best spam protection on the planet when used competently. I never get false positives or spam in my inbox (well maybe one a month) as I use it to sort email with my/a whitelist

My SpamCop members sort list protects me and everyone else from drongo providers who bounce email/viruses to spamtraps as well as Job Job the planet! Then yell it's SpamCop's fault that we are annoying idiot's

"Postmasters, please limit forgery blow-back" might wish to read before opening mouth for foot, or go away continuing to be ignorant

Edited by petzl

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You have not indicated what IP address you believe to be blocked.

I just did a little detective work, and I think that the server that *was* blocked was:

69.20.21.155 = evohost.net

It's showing as not blocked at the moment, but in the current SenderBase display, the SpamCop BL status is still showing as blocked:

http://www.senderbase.org/?sb=1&searchBy=i...ng=69.20.21.155

so it either fell off the list automatically, or Mr. Kruger (the "Paul" who is posting here, who owns the company) might have used the one-time-removal feature. Either way, we can't provide him any details about the reason for the listing...I think that only the Deputies (and of course his host, Rackspace) can do that at present.

However, a Google on that IP address results in a listing on a "backscatter" page:

http://postmaster.gtcs.com/NameserversAmuk.php

So, it may be that the server is sending out "after the fact" bounces, which will indeed cause it to get listed on the SpamCop BL from time to time.

DT

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