dbiel Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 If I am reading this correctly, your email address is xxx[at]spamcop.net You have a spamcop email account and are report mail recieved directly by your spamcop account (not forwarded from anyother account) 1st question, why in the world would you want to use the cut and paste method when there is a much simpler method as well as a second method that does not require all the additional work. Method 2: forward as attachment to your submit to address. Method 1: use the VER interface and access your heldmail from their and you have several reporting options 1)full reporting, 2) quick reporting Method 3: report spam from the webmail interface (note: it is quick reporting only) 2nd question, it looks to me that you have not set up you spamcop email address as one of your mail hosts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfighter Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 Agreed, but after so many "hints" ....???? As seen in the SpamCop FAQ "here" ... an entry titled How To Ask Questions The Smart Way (language issue, but there really is only one defintion for RTFM) was one shot at educating folks to how to frame a 'good' query. Knowing that this was probably not going to be read, I went in and added an entry in the How to Use ... SpamCop Forum section that offered a suggestion on things to include in a query within this Forum. Even went the extra and Pinned it as Forum Use, General Intro And this data mentioned after all the previous references to the How to Use... Forum section for Reporting issues. On what link in the SpamCop Webmail Menu does one click in order to find that information? How does one get to that information starting at the SpamCop sitemap? http://www.spamcop.net/sitemap.shtml -- FF EDIT: once again, fixed the quote tags .. removed oh so much extra white-space Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbiel Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 How does one get to that information starting at the SpamCop sitemap? http://www.spamcop.net/sitemap.shtml The closest answer would be: Forums General discussion Email discussion Mailhosts system discussion NNTP (usenet style) Newsgroups Clicking on forms would bring to to the main forum listing. Clicking on Email Discussion would take you to the Email forum where you would find the following: "Pinned: Original SpamCop FAQ Plus - Read before Posting FAQ = Frequently Asked Questions" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farelf Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 ... On what link in the SpamCop Webmail Menu does one click in order to find that information? How does one get to that information starting at the SpamCop sitemap?... 33320[/snapback] And, to follow dbiel, if the query is making a point, (is rhetorical, more in the line of Rumpole's Dictum - "don't ask the question if you don't know the answer"), sincere sympathy ... lots of content, complexity etc. I think most (all?) of us are still learning, given the "The primary mode of support here is peer-to-peer, meaning users helping other users. (please remember this at all times!)" thing from the head of the forum pages. Wazoo hasn't been pushing his attempt to come up with an improved intro structure (the SpamCop Portal), but I think it is helpful. You may find it so too, haven't seen that you've been pointed that way already - concentrate on the FAQ/Explanatory material on the right-hand side in the first instance: http://forum.spamcop.net/forums/index.php?act=home The same material, but structured to assist a broad range of inquiry without being labyrinthine. Hope it helps. Meanwhile, dbiel's questions in the other post, 3 posts earlier, are trying to get to the specifics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenUnderwood Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 OK, same problem. Here's the tracking URL: http://www.spamcop.net/sc?id=z809689387z1e...fc8c89b11af6c1z Why can't SpamCop parse this? 33314[/snapback] The reason given is mailgate.cesmail.net not associated with any of your mailhosts which does not make sense because spamcop settings are usually inserted automatically. My mailhosts show that as the second entry down on the spamcop mailhost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff G. Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 The reason given is mailgate.cesmail.net not associated with any of your mailhosts which does not make sense because spamcop settings are usually inserted automatically. My mailhosts show that as the second entry down on the spamcop mailhost.33330[/snapback] Someone posted many moons ago to the effect that SpamCop Email System Accounts were automatically added to Mailhosts. i didn't find that to be true at the time. FF, please add yours. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenUnderwood Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Someone posted many moons ago to the effect that SpamCop Email System Accounts were automatically added to Mailhosts. i didn't find that to be true at the time. FF, please add yours. Thanks! 33340[/snapback] Jeff, When I went into Mailhosts to start the config on my account associated with my spamcop address, it was definitely added already for me. This was about a month after it was announced, when I knew better the limitations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff G. Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I may have started earlier than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wazoo Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 OK, same problem. Not really ... the "broken" lines aren't present in this one ...???? http://www.spamcop.net/sc?id=z809689387z1e...fc8c89b11af6c1z Why can't SpamCop parse this? 33314[/snapback] Actually, it can. See http://www.spamcop.net/sc?id=z809859834zec...d28fac5fe3edf4z As mentioned elsewhere, you have a MailHost issue with this reporting account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wazoo Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 It may be that the header problem was NOT just a whitespace/linewrap issue. The person who 'fixed' my headers to make them parse didn't actually say what was done. It just looked to me that he put each header on its own line. There is no doubt that cutting an pasting into the "report spam" window introduces a number of chnges in the way the headers are wrapped. I do it all the time, but haven't run into the issues of btoken lines, added returns, etc. This is what I'm strying to figure out in your case, as you state that you are using 'standard' tools. I'm having the same problem again with another spam from the same source and have posted a tracking URL in another article. I'm using FireFox 1.0.4. 33316[/snapback] I just successfully parsed your sample and posted this. FireFox is currently at 1.07, and it is highly suggested that you get updated. Security and display issues are just a couple of the things behind those upgrades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wazoo Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 else ... is the web-browser window sizeable? The SpamCop "Report spam" window is not resizeable, when you paste spam into it that is longer than the window scroll bars appear. Changing the size of the FireFox browser window does not change the size of the SpamCop "Report spam" window. 33318[/snapback] The question was about the web-browser interface to the e-mail contents. The "paste-your-spam-in-the-box" has its own history, but it accepts most anything thrown at it. The changing of content would not happen there .. rather at the point of the selecting and copy operation from the osurce, in this case the web-browser intoface to the web-mail app ... and I'm not sure anyone answered this question ye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wazoo Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Wazoo hasn't been pushing his attempt to come up with an improved intro structure (the SpamCop Portal), but I think it is helpful. You may find it so too, haven't seen that you've been pointed that way already - concentrate on the FAQ/Explanatory material on the right-hand side in the first instance: http://forum.spamcop.net/forums/index.php?act=home The same material, but structured to assist a broad range of inquiry without being labyrinthine. Hope it helps. 33328[/snapback] Hard to push when you've got no traction <g> Attempt at gathering input from the newsgroup side on that page got into how much the code sucked, not quite jiving with my "let's talk about content" questions. Don looked at it and said "looks good" ... Mike Easter, anti-forum rabblerouser that he is, recently admitted that he uses it as his intro to checking on Forum content <g> That about wraps up the "positive" feedback ... will now add your comments here to that short list (thanks) As stated in many other places, the Forum version of the SpamCop FAQ was originally just a Saturday morning hack, intended as something to exist until the "better" thing came along. The "better" thing is still not available / implemented. So I/we are just continuing to work with what tools and access "we" have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wazoo Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 On what link in the SpamCop Webmail Menu does one click in order to find that information? No idea myself, but as you are asking about Reporting issues, one would normally start from the Help button on the www.spamcop.net page. This leads one into the www.spamcop.net FAQ .. and the navigation and content issues there are what caused my original Saturday morning hack that started the Forum version of that FAQ. On the other hand, now that you have already found your way 'here' .. links are provided at the top of the screen, Pinned item at the entry of each Forum section ... How does one get to that information starting at the SpamCop sitemap? http://www.spamcop.net/sitemap.shtml 33320[/snapback] You are asking volunteers why work done by volunteers hasn't been incorporated into documentation that has been complained about for years. Again, I'm doing the best I can with the tools and access granted, and I've got some great folks helping me out. Beyond that, I have no answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenUnderwood Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 The question was about the web-browser interface to the e-mail contents. The "paste-your-spam-in-the-box" has its own history, but it accepts most anything thrown at it. The changing of content would not happen there .. rather at the point of the selecting and copy operation from the osurce, in this case the web-browser intoface to the web-mail app ... and I'm not sure anyone answered this question ye. 33353[/snapback] The "Message Source" link inside of spamcop's webmail app does no wrapping of the data no matter the size of the window, instead using the same scroll bars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfighter Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 Someone posted many moons ago to the effect that SpamCop Email System Accounts were automatically added to Mailhosts. i didn't find that to be true at the time. FF, please add yours. Thanks! 33340[/snapback] Indeed, that has taken care of the problem, thanks. -- FF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfighter Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 ... You are asking volunteers why work done by volunteers hasn't been incorporated into documentation that has been complained about for years... 33356[/snapback] I see. They don't care, they don't have to care, they have volunteers to mitigate the problem for them. -- FF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfighter Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 If I am reading this correctly, your email address is xxx[at]spamcop.net You have a spamcop email account and are report mail recieved directly by your spamcop account (not forwarded from anyother account) 1st question, why in the world would you want to use the cut and paste method when there is a much simpler method as well as a second method that does not require all the additional work. Method 2: forward as attachment to your submit to address. Method 1: use the VER interface and access your heldmail from their and you have several reporting options 1)full reporting, 2) quick reporting Method 3: report spam from the webmail interface (note: it is quick reporting only) 2nd question, it looks to me that you have not set up you spamcop email address as one of your mail hosts. 33319[/snapback] If I submit the spam to queue by any method then to see how it parses I have to work through all the other spam in the queue to get to the spam of interest. Cutting and pasting allows me to quickly deal with spam I personally consider to deserve a higher priority. Quick reporting does not allow me to see how it parses and does not give me any control over how the complaints are directed. What is the "VEN interface"? When SpamCop added the MailHosts feature users were (mis) informed that it was not necessary to add the SpamCop mailhosts temselves. That was supposed to be done automagically by SpamCop Admin. I have added mine manually and things seem to work OK now. Concerns about line-wrap etc appear to have been spurious. -- FF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfighter Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 The closest answer would be: Clicking on forms would bring to to the main forum listing. Clicking on Email Discussion would take you to the Email forum where you would find the following: "Pinned: Original SpamCop FAQ Plus - Read before Posting FAQ = Frequently Asked Questions" 33324[/snapback] Well I did that and then used the webbrowser search for "How To Ask Questions The Smart Way" and didn't find anything on that page. The Google search at the top of the page resulted in about a hunderd hits, including this thread, but none looked particularly promising. So, I have no idea how to find it, which perhpas explains why I' not asking these questions very smartly. I think most users, upon finding themselves among the fora, will assume they have gotten lost and go back. Should they realize they have not made a msitake they are then faced with trying to figure out how to use these fora and that's a PITA. From what I have read in other articles, this is neither your fault, nor under your control so please do not take this to be criticism of yourselves. Personally, I am grateful for your replies. In people's articles I keep seeing "Pinned:" prior to a topic. Of what significance is "Pinned:"? -- FF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenUnderwood Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 In people's articles I keep seeing "Pinned:" prior to a topic. Of what significance is "Pinned:"? 33374[/snapback] Pinned keeps the article visible (does not age off like other articles) and at the top of the section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wazoo Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Well I did that and then used the webbrowser search for "How To Ask Questions The Smart Way" and didn't find anything on that page. Personally, I'm a bit confused at this .. can only imagine that you had not yet actually followed the link at the top of the page (actually twice, one opens up a new browser instance, the other opens up a new page, depends on your browser (configuration) and any keystrokes used [i.e. holding down the Shift key under IE opens up the link in a new window]) The Google search at the top of the page resulted in about a hunderd hits, including this thread, but none looked particularly promising. Not knowing how you actually entered your 'search' data ... whittling away at Google results can be a bit of the black art .... special codes, Boolean logic, etc. So, I have no idea how to find it, which perhpas explains why I' not asking these questions very smartly. It still sounds to me as if you have yet to actually hit/follow one of the provided links here to reach the Forum version of the SpamCop FAQ. (or tried the Portal page yet) I think most users, upon finding themselves among the fora, will assume they have gotten lost and go back. Should they realize they have not made a msitake they are then faced with trying to figure out how to use these fora and that's a PITA. I will also have to assume you've not visited the How to Use .... SpamCop Forum forum section yet? Or even followed the link to the (unfinished) Forum FAQ yet? From what I have read in other articles, this is neither your fault, nor under your control so please do not take this to be criticism of yourselves. Personally, I am grateful for your replies. In people's articles I keep seeing "Pinned:" prior to a topic. Of what significance is "Pinned:"? 33374[/snapback] Thanks for the kind words. However, kind of stuck again, as all Pinned: items are prefaced with the Pinned: tag ... working at how you are not seeing that ...???? Only thing I can come up with is that your have bookmarked yourself to a specific Topic vice coming into the Forum "front" page ...???? As StevenUnderwood has offered, the act of Pinning: a Topic keeps it on the first page of the Forum section. Most folks don't notice the "From 30 days" dropdown at the bottom of the Topic display page, so also don't realize that there may be a wealth of info existing beyond what they first "see" .... By being "Pinned:", that article remains on the first displayed page of that Forum section and does nor age off ... theory being that it's data that has to be scrolled through to see the "rest of" / current postings, suggesting that these items actually be noted/read, especially those tagged with the additional "Read before posting" .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff G. Posted September 28, 2005 Share Posted September 28, 2005 Well I did that and then used the webbrowser search for "How To Ask Questions The Smart Way" and didn't find anything on that page. The Google search at the top of the page resulted in about a hunderd hits, including this thread, but none looked particularly promising. So, I have no idea how to find it, which perhpas explains why I' not asking these questions very smartly. 33374[/snapback] The link is How To Ask Questions The Smart Way (language issue, but there really is only one defintion for RTFM) in the SpamCop FAQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbiel Posted September 28, 2005 Share Posted September 28, 2005 If I submit the spam to queue by any method then to see how it parses I have to work through all the other spam in the queue to get to the spam of interest. Cutting and pasting allows me to quickly deal with spam I personally consider to deserve a higher priority. Quick reporting does not allow me to see how it parses and does not give me any control over how the complaints are directed. What is the "VEN interface"? 33373[/snapback] I am having some trouble following your logic. If you select the messages you want to cut and paste, why can you not just select that same block of messages and forward them as attachments (there is a limit on how large that file can be) Then open up the reporting interface and parse one after the other until you have finished. The other interface VER can be accessed by clicking on "HeldMail" in the menu bar of the reporting interface. For more information about VER see FAQ Entry: What is VER (Very Easy Reporting)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farelf Posted September 28, 2005 Share Posted September 28, 2005 In addition to the above, your concerns about reporting from webmail (with quick reporting enabled) seem to be directly addressed in the StevenUnderwood "How to Use" post : http://forum.spamcop.net/forums/index.php?...indpost&p=23436 May I suggest, FF, that you also cast an eye over that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfighter Posted September 30, 2005 Author Share Posted September 30, 2005 Personally, I'm a bit confused at this .. can only imagine that you had not yet actually followed the link at the top of the page (actually twice, one opens up a new browser instance, the other opens up a new page, depends on your browser (configuration) and any keystrokes used [i.e. holding down the Shift key under IE opens up the link in a new window]) Clicking on that link was the first thing I did. That took me to a long page with fine type. Rather than reading through the page from top to bottom in the hope of finding that subject heading I used the browsers search feature and the browser's search feature did not find that string on that page. Maybe it is on that page but obscured from the bowser search feature by soem HTML feature. It still sounds to me as if you have yet to actually hit/follow one of the provided links here to reach the Forum version of the SpamCop FAQ. (or tried the Portal page yet) I will also have to assume you've not visited the How to Use .... SpamCop Forum forum section yet? Or even followed the link to the (unfinished) Forum FAQ yet? 33376[/snapback] I have read the SpamCop FAQ that is hyperlinked from somwhere near the SpamCop 'homepage" it is pretty sparse. Oddly enough, you didn;t include a hyperlink to it in your reply. Do you have touble finding it yourself? :-) No worries. My SpamCop email account will expire soon. -- FF Edited by Moderator to fix broken quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredfighter Posted September 30, 2005 Author Share Posted September 30, 2005 I am having some trouble following your logic. If you select the messages you want to cut and paste, why can you not just select that same block of messages and forward them as attachments (there is a limit on how large that file can be) Then open up the reporting interface and parse one after the other until you have finished. Uh, can't you see how it is easier to cut and paste directly into the parser than it is to cut and paste into an email client and then email it to the reporting address, or to save it to a file and then attach that file to an email and then send that email to the reporting address. Further, If a particular spam has my immediate attention, I do not WANT to wade thorugh the entire queue one spam at a time, until I get to it. ALso, if the spam that is submitted to the queue via email does not parse I may not have the option of seeing why. WHen a spam submitted via queu does not parse the "Viewe Source: hyperlink is foten missing from the resulting page. That is a problem I have reported and been told, "We don't know why that happened, tell us if it happens again." The other interface VER can be accessed by clicking on "HeldMail" in the menu bar of the reporting interface. For more information about VER see FAQ Entry: What is VER (Very Easy Reporting)? 33380[/snapback] VER = "Very Easy Reporting", OK that makes sense now but really, did you think I'd guess that on my own. There are three ways to submit from the Held Mail directory. 1) Quick reporting -- I do not get to see how it parses. 2) Submitting to the queue -- See above 3) Cutting and pasting from the View Source window. At this point, honesty requires that I confess that some of these otpions are not available to me as I have accidently quick reported too may of spamcops automated replies. Differential prescriptions in my left and right eye, compounded by gross carelessness is why. Thanks. -- FF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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