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ricktravers

Ongoing stripping of attachments

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I'm repeatedly having attachments stripped off of emails when I send them via webmail. The problem is not failure to click "Attach" (as I explain below) and I can reproduce the failure about 60% of the time. Also, it may be relevant that I have been using Spamcop Webmail for many years and have successfully sent hundreds of emails with attachments. This problem only appeared a few months ago and it is still happening. Here are the procedures I'm using and the results:

1) Compose message in http webmail (not https), addressing and inserting subject

2) In the Attachments section for File 1, click browse and select file to attach (size under 2MB) and click Open

3) Click the Attach button on the right side of the Attachment section

4) Confirm attachment is actually attached by viewing new text at top of window just underneath "Message composition" that shows "thumbs up" icon and says "Added XXX.yyy as an attachment". I also scroll down to bottom of message where I see attachment icon, name, and (among other things) the words "Total attachments size ZZZ" This proves I correctly clicked "attach" button and that the message has an attachment.

5) Click Send Message

6) Attachment is stripped off email and only body is sent

7) Repeat steps 1-5 exactly the same and eventually it works and attachment is sent with body, though it can take up to 3 tries.

Also, the following procedures show same problem:

1) Create an email as above

2) Attach a document as above

3) Confirm attachment is attached as above

4) Save to drafts

5) Open draft

6) Attachment is no longer attached

7) Repeat steps 1-5 and eventually it works and draft includes attachment, though it can take up to 3 tries.

Then, after saved draft correctly shows attachment as attached,

8) Open draft

9) Confirm attachment is shown as attached as above

10) Click Send

11) Attachment is stripped off email and only body is sent

12) Open drafts folder and note draft is still there and attachment is still shown as attached (!)

13) Repeat steps 8-10, and after 1-3 tries (without modification), it is sent correctly including attachment.

Please note this is NOT a failure to click "attach". If it were, I would not be able to see attachment as attached as described above. Perusing other's questions it is clear that others are having the same problem, but it appears that everyone is assuming they are failing to click "attach." However, some are obviously experienced Webmail users who understand the correct steps yet still have the same problem as me. The only thing I can think of that may be unusual in my case is that I live in London, England, so my access is slower than most.

Perhaps most importantly, I can reproduce this problem roughly 60% of the time, so I can easily demonstrate the problem by allowing any qualified person to log in to my account and try it for themselves.

This problem is very frustrating and occasionally embarassing, so I would be grateful to anyone who can help. It would also be helpful to hear from anyone having the same problem. If you do, please make clear that you understand the critical step of clicking "Attach" (browsing and opening file is NOT sufficient).

Thank you very much for your help!

Regards,

Rick

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Do you find that it makes any difference if the setting is for "inline" vs "attachment". Or does the problem have either way.

Note: this is not a recommendation, as each is used for its own specific purposes; just as a tool to try to help isolate the problem.

Also it might be helpful to know what browser and version you are using as well as the operating system.

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Thanks for your reply! I have only tried "attachment", but I will try "inline" and reply with the results. I am using IE v6.0 on WinXP v5.1 SP2.

Regards, Rick

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Perhaps most importantly, I can reproduce this problem roughly 60% of the time, so I can easily demonstrate the problem by allowing any qualified person to log in to my account and try it for themselves.

I have actually done exactly the above for at least a half-dozen folks. The results have always been that everything seemed to work for me ... and after sending several e-mails with CC:s to several other places to show that even that flew, posted the the results in the specific Topic involved, I never seem to hear anything more from those folks. Whether they figured out what was going wrong, they gave up, something started working .. I don't know .. just noting that the discussion always seems to stop ...

This problem is very frustrating and occasionally embarassing, so I would be grateful to anyone who can help. It would also be helpful to hear from anyone having the same problem. If you do, please make clear that you understand the critical step of clicking "Attach" (browsing and opening file is NOT sufficient).

It hasn't come up in a long while ... though there is a Topic within the lst week that dealt with >2Meg files .. and this was primarily about incoming e-mail ....

No newsgroup traffic on this complaint in anything close to recent history .....

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What kinds of files are you trying to attach?

I just did your test and in both cases, the .exe attachment was dropped while the .zip attachment was preserved, from the same message.

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Hi Steven,

Thank you for your help!

Here are a few examples with date (month/day/year), time and zone, my location at the time, and extension of attachment. In every case I was eventually able to send the attachment after repeated tries.

3/30/06 14:11 GMT Prague .pdf

4/3/06 16:38 GMT Prague .pdf

5/30/06 17:20 GMT London .pdf

6/14/06 16:55 GMT London .zip

7/4/06 15:55 GMT London .doc

Looking at these examples I'm struck that all but one occured on weekdays at very close to the same time of day. When I said I could reproduce the problem roughly 60% of the time, I should have clarified that I have consistently reproduced the problem if I make repeated attempts immediately after a failure. I have just tried to reproduce it now (when I'm not experiencing problems), but I can't. The fact that I can reproduce the problem at those times on weekdays further suggests the problem may be related to time of day and weekday/weekend, perhaps server load? I will do some tests this week to see if I can confirm the pattern, and report back to this thread.

Kind regards,

Rick

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I've just now tried 16 seprate emails with assorted .doc and .pdf attachments from 109KB to 1938KB. Some were sent as "attachment", some were sent as "inline". Ten emails had their attachments stripped, and six did not. The stripping affected both inline and attachment methods, and affected both .doc and .pdf attachments. The only discernable pattern is that failures and successes tended to be bunched together sequentially, as follows. (Times are GMT, location is London):

16:19:20 Fail

16:21:40 Fail

16:23:27 Succeed

16:24:34 Succeed

16:25:12 Succeed

16:26:34 Succeed

16:27:11 Fail

16:27:37 Fail

16:28:23 Fail

16:28:59 Fail

16:29:19 Fail

16:29:59 Fail

16:30:34 Succeed

16:31:07 Succeed

16:31:49 Fail

16:32:46 Fail

If anyone in the is free to try right now in USA or abroad, it might be enlightening to see the results.

Regards,

Rick

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I just tried four such attempts and the attachments arrived intact each time....but it's two days later, so maybe your theory about it happening during some sort of temporary server situation is on track.

DT

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Another possibility, that I have no idea how to confirm, is that there may be different servers involved like with reporting (blade1,2,3,4,5 etc) and that the problem may relate to a specific server. Just an idea which relates to problems I been having at work, where do to load balancing, you never know what server you are actually using and they are NOT all set the same, different fonts installed, different versions of apps installed etc. and as a result things work differently or sometimes don't work at all, depending upon what server you happen to get connected to.

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Here's a header of one from a few minutes ago today:

Received: from ip-55.55.99.216.dsl-cust.ca.inter.net

(ip-55.55.99.216.dsl-cust.ca.inter.net [216.99.55.55]) by

webmail.spamcop.net (Horde) with HTTP for

<rcurzon[at]spamcop.net[at]cesmail.net>; Sun, 16 Jul 2006 17:24:17 -0400

Message-ID: <20060716172417.07ogkg0c4kc0scwo[at]webmail.spamcop.net>

Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2006 17:24:17 -0400

From: rcurzon[at]spamcop.net

To: Nancy Curzon <ncurzon[at]muchoswing.com>

Subject: gamecube photos

MIME-Version: 1.0

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"

Content-Disposition: inline

Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 4.0-cvs

Gamecube photos

====

The photos appeared in the attachments list when I pushed send.

My workaround I reported here last month of clicking Refresh Attachments didn't help, and it hasn't helped in other cases today.

Today I tried sending 3 emails with attachments, all of them arrived without attachments. Also, they show up in my sent folder without attachments.

I haven't really tried it since the last time it failed and I reported it here, don't do a lot of attachments.

R

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Your headers look a bit incomplete. You've only included one "Received" line, and it's not the one that would show which server your message was handled by. I just sent two messages with attachments using the webmail system, and when they arrived at my broadband account (which isn't forwarded between any ISPs), there were six "Received" entries in the headers, with only the last one being internal to my ISP. The others, presented only in truncated fashion were:

Received: from mailgate.cesmail.net ([216.154.195.36])

by ...

Received: (qmail 17299 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2006 22:24:59 -0000

Received: from unknown (HELO delta.cesmail.net) (192.168.1.30)

by mailgate.cesmail.net with SMTP; 16 Jul 2006 22:24:59 -0000

Received: (qmail 19363 invoked by uid 99); 16 Jul 2006 22:24:59 -0000

Received: from ip.at.my.isp.munged

(alphanumeric_ip_munged [actual connection IP]) by webmail.spamcop.net

(Horde) with HTTP for <mySCid[at]spamcop.net[at]cesmail.net>; Sun, 16 Jul 2006

15:24:59 -0700

You'll see that this one was handled by "delta." while another I just sent was handled by "gamma." (they have different IP addresses). Which server handled the outgoing messages that lost their attachments?

DT

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I've just checked all the tests I ran on 7/12/06, and every one used server Delta, both succeessful and failed. Headers below are from last failure:

...

Received: from mailgate.cesmail.net (mailgate.cesmail.net [216.154.195.36])

by ...

Received: (qmail 12076 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2006 16:32:46 -0000

Received: from unknown (HELO delta.cesmail.net) (192.168.1.30)

by mailgate.cesmail.net with SMTP; 12 Jul 2006 16:32:46 -0000

Received: (qmail 18703 invoked by uid 99); 12 Jul 2006 16:32:46 -0000

Received: from ip.at.my.isp.munged

(alphanumeric_ip_munged [actual connection IP]) by

webmail.spamcop.net (Horde) with HTTP for

<mySCid[at]spamcop.net[at]cesmail.net>; Wed, 12 Jul 2006 17:32:46 +0100

...

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I am having the exact same issues as Rick. And I ran the exact same tests, too.

I'm not sending exe files or com files, and my system is virus free. I have tried it on computers here at home and will also try it at school.

It's terribly frustrating.

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I am having the exact same issues as Rick. And I ran the exact same tests, too.

OK, there are a few people experiencing this problem consistently. Others of us do not see the problem at all. What we need is more details about your setups... what type of internet connection you have, what AV products (if any) you are using, what anti-spyware products you are using, what firewall (software or hardware) you might be using. The browser you use could be important as well, though I think we already discovered it is not.

At work, I have a 3MB fiber connection, Norton AV v10, Webroot SpySweeper, CheckPoint or Cisco firewalls. I have seen no problems attaching files and having them delivered. I use XP Pro, IE6SP2

At home, I have a 3MB cable connection through a LinkSys wireless router/firewall and LinkSys cable modem. I use AVG Anti-Virus and Windows Defender anti-spyware. I have seen no problems attaching files and having them delivered. I use XP Home, IE6SP2.

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I may have solved the mystery.... it *MAY* have to do with code changes that made Spamcop more Mozilla friendly -- and as a result of the patch it doesn't like Internet Explorer.

I downloaded Firefox (which I've tried and I don't care for) and installed it. With Firefox installed, I could then send as an attachment all kinds of docs. But it doesn't work with my IE.

Now... this is a new computer, I do know how to install software, and I haven't monked with IE other than adding Google toolbar. Using (arrrgh) Firefox worked for me. I *do NOT* like it as a solution, but it does make my Spamcop account work again.

I'd be happier if it worked under my IE.

For any of you having problems, try the latest Firefox... see if that resolves it.

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I may have solved the mystery.... it *MAY* have to do with code changes that made Spamcop more Mozilla friendly -- and as a result of the patch it doesn't like Internet Explorer.

I downloaded Firefox (which I've tried and I don't care for) and installed it. With Firefox installed, I could then send as an attachment all kinds of docs. But it doesn't work with my IE.

Now... this is a new computer, I do know how to install software, and I haven't monked with IE other than adding Google toolbar. Using (arrrgh) Firefox worked for me. I *do NOT* like it as a solution, but it does make my Spamcop account work again.

I'd be happier if it worked under my IE.

For any of you having problems, try the latest Firefox... see if that resolves it.

As stated, I use IE exclusively. Perhaps the Google toolbar? Perhaps just the pop up blocker of google toolbar? I have had several issues with that tool in our corporate environment and have disabled to pop up blocker portion on all installs.

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I am having the exact same issues as Rick. And I ran the exact same tests, too.

I'm sorry .. but the troubles you described in "your" Topic are NOT an exact match for the issues described in 'this' Topic. Therefore, It is not seen that your "solution" would solve "this" Topic's situation .. for instance, you are also suggesting that FF solved the time-related problems that are descibed 'here' ...????

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I'm sorry .. but the troubles you described in "your" Topic are NOT an exact match for the issues described in 'this' Topic. Therefore, It is not seen that your "solution" would solve "this" Topic's situation .. for instance, you are also suggesting that FF solved the time-related problems that are descibed 'here' ...????

Hi Wazoo,

Thank you very much for your help and attention to this problem. I'm a bit puzzled by your response to pyrts. pyrts has stated he is experiencing "the exact same issues" as me, and has suggested a possible cause (the code patch), and a workaround that works for him (FF). I think pyrts' tests and suggestions have been helpful and I think pyrts would agree that his FF suggestion is more of a "workaround" than a "solution". Lastly, I don't think we have yet proven my problem is time-related, although there is some circumstantial evidence it is. Perhaps it would help if pyrts could explicitly state the symptoms of his problem (and times, if intermittent) to confirm it's the same issue as mine?

I deeply appreciate everyone's attention to this problem, so I want to help as much as possible. Steven Underwood's reply suggests the code patch may not be the problem, and poses the possibility that Google toolbar and/or a popup blocker may be a cause. I don't use Google toolbar and I permit all popups from spamcop.net, so that's apparently not my cause. I have just returned from holiday and am a bit overwhelmed, but I will try to find the time today to run a series of tests that may help. I will try to reproduce the problem using multiple browsers on my laptop, and as many browsers as possible from as many different OSs as possible from an internet cafe. I will document the results and report back to this thread. If anyone has any suggestions or requests for my tests, please reply.

Kind regards,

Rick

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I'm a bit puzzled by your response to pyrts. pyrts has stated he is experiencing "the exact same issues" as me,

Having trouble sending attachments, email account problem

For many years I was able to successfully send attachments through my email account. This stopped working about a year ago. I checked the boards and saw an announcement that it had been repaired -- but I still haven't been able to send documents, etc, via attachment.

This does not "match" your problem ..... certainly not "exactly" .....

Perhaps it would help if pyrts could explicitly state the symptoms of his problem (and times, if intermittent) to confirm it's the same issue as mine?

Part of my filling the Admin slot means I have to read everything. I do find it confusing when I note that some users looking for help do not look at anything outside of the Topic they decide to start. Those issues that are "the same" will generally be merged .. but as noted, your issue and pyrts's description of his/her problem do not match in my eyes. "Stopped working a year ago" versus "some of them don't go out" .... a huge difference to me ....

I will try to reproduce the problem using multiple browsers on my laptop, and as many browsers as possible from as many different OSs as possible from an internet cafe. I will document the results and report back to this thread. If anyone has any suggestions or requests for my tests, please reply.

As I suggested in pyrts's Topic, a number of other / previous Topics .... I've had folks in the past provide me their login details ... I then tested from here using multiple platforms, mulriple browsers, etc., etc., etc. In all but one case, I could not duplicate the problem .. on the other hand, those folks never bothered to follow up. Whether that was because they fixed something, something else happened, they didn't think it was worth following up, ...???? I don't have a clue .. they just stopped posting .... pyrts has yet to respond to that suggestion in that other Topix .....

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Why is it every time I use webmail and select a file and attach it is doesn't get sent? It clearly says "file.blah" is attahced. What's going on?

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Why is it every time I use webmail and select a file and attach it is doesn't get sent? It clearly says "file.blah" is attahced. What's going on?

Multiple previous queries .... answered many times with "works for me" by others .. I merged this 'new' Topic into the most recent exchange about this 'problem' .... smae stuff applies .. same offer applies ...

PM sent to advise of this move/merge ...

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mkennedy02 PM'd me login data .... did that, sent an e-mail to one address, CC:'d to another .... the e=mail with attachment was stored in the Sent-mail folder in that account, was received at the "To:" address .... will wait for StevenUnderwood's verificatoin that the CC: made it ....

Difference, I sent a .jpg, vice the statement of using Office documents .. something I am very against doing .... but if further testing is required ????

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mkennedy02 PM'd me login data .... did that, sent an e-mail to one address, CC:'d to another .... the e=mail with attachment was stored in the Sent-mail folder in that account, was received at the "To:" address .... will wait for StevenUnderwood's verificatoin that the CC: made it ....

Difference, I sent a .jpg, vice the statement of using Office documents .. something I am very against doing .... but if further testing is required ????

I replied this morning to the email. I did receive it with attachment in tact.

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Received via e-mail, resulting from my successful sending of a graphic attachment from his account;

If you can sent 1 picture and I can't what does that mean? I don't know how to

browse to a file and click the attach button?

Mike

I am not sure what it says other than I didn't manage to duplicate the problem. This has happened in the past, user complains, user passes me some data, I login to their account, have no problem, post the results ... never hear from the user again ...

Some more troubleshooting needed? Other recent complaints tried to suggest a "timing" issue, but again, this hasn't really been successfully recreated by others, though noting that there is also a location part of the equation possible involved .... offset by the lack of other user complaints ....????

I do recall checking your 'sent mail' folder to see if what I sent had been saved ... do recall seeing some Subject Lines that suggested that there would have been attachments, but noticed that the file sizes were along the lines of 3 or 4k .. not much of an attachment, expecially when you suggest that normal attachments are 'Office' documents.

If the account data is the same, I could send some "Office" stuff ... just not sure what that specific link to a "not attaching" issue could turn out to be ... I ran across an old PowerPoint Presentation file that an old Army buffy sent me, a shuttle tank recovery in progress, pocked up while he was working as a NASA contractor .... less than 800k ... but that's one of those things that I loathe about sending 'Office' documents .. does the recipient have a PowerPoint viewer, am I going to overload the recipient's InBox, etc.

Hmmm, looking back through the previous posts, it appears I'm mixing up some user data ....

What type of files are you attempting to send?

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What type of files are you attempting to send?

.doc (word) and .xls (excel). When I send an attachment it's usually just 1 file. If I have to send multiple files I usually zip them.

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