How to let users know that it isn't spam?

[jrhett]

The SpamCop reporting thing is nice, but something is either unclear to me or missing. I'm hoping someone can clue me in.

Someone reports a message as spam. You do a bit of research and find that it clearly isn't spam. How can we reply to the user?

Example: mailing list message reported as spam.

Research:

1. Valid, real signup-only mailing list

2. Member signed up a year ago

3. Archives of the list show this person as a frequent poster on the list

So clearly they made a mistake in reporting this. A couple of things need to be done.

1. We need some way to report to the user that a mistake was made (on their part)

2. The incident should be pulled from the statistics (if the user agrees, naturally)

[Miss Betsy]

Ok, now we are getting somewhere. You think that someone has reported as spam a newsletter that you publish that s/he has signed up for and that you can prove that they did.

Did you you reply to the report saying that your list is confirmed subscription only and that you have verified that your unsubscribe is working so you think a mistake might have been made?

Occasionally reporters do make mistakes (they are human). However, one mistake does not usually result in a listing on the spamcop blocklist.

When you said (in another post) that 'email will look into it', do you mean you have already emailed a spamcop deputy?

And what is the IP address you are concerned about?

Miss Betsy

[StevenUnderwood]

The SpamCop reporting thing is nice, but something is either unclear to me or missing.  I'm hoping someone can clue me in.

Someone reports a message as spam.  You do a bit of research and find that it clearly isn't spam.  How can we reply to the user?

Example: mailing list message reported as spam.

Research:

1. Valid, real signup-only mailing list

2. Member signed up a year ago

3. Archives of the list show this person as a frequent poster on the list

So clearly they made a mistake in reporting this.  A couple of things need to be done.

1. We need some way to report to the user that a mistake was made (on their part)

2. The incident should be pulled from the statistics (if the user agrees, naturally)

37908[/snapback]

There should be a link inside the report for actions to take. Also, you have a unique email address to reach that user as stated in the report (or on the web page mentioned above). Be aware that the reporter is under no obligation to reply to your email, however, so present all the information you have and ask them if they agree to contact the deputies (See How can I unsend a Report?) You should probably also CC: the deputies[at]spamcop.net address in your message. They may act without reporter information.

Also, if you think it was done on purpose, and you can show the deputies the abuse of the system, the reporter can be penalized, including loss of reporting privs. Again, I believe this is an option within the report page.

It is likely this message ended up among the spam they get and was reported accidentally.

[turetzsr]

<snip>

Someone reports a message as spam.  You do a bit of research and find that it clearly isn't spam.  How can we reply to the user?

<snip>

1. We need some way to report to the user that a mistake was made (on their part)

2. The incident should be pulled from the statistics (if the user agrees, naturally)

37908[/snapback]

Hi!

...There are a few SpamCop FAQ (see link, above, labeled "SpamCop FAQ") entries that I believe address your questions:

• Has your email been blocked? (ISP, Mailing List Admin, Advertiser)
  
• How can I be de-listed
  
• I have been falsely and/or maliciously accused of spamming, what can I do?
  
• How do I get in touch with the person who filed the complaint?
  

If anything here still leaves you with a question in your mind, please pop back in here to ask them as follow-ups. Thanks!

[jrhett]

Ok, now we are getting somewhere.  You think that someone has reported as spam a newsletter that you publish that s/he has signed up for and that you can prove that they did. 

Did you you reply to the report saying that your list is confirmed subscription only and that you have verified that your unsubscribe is working so you think a mistake might have been made?

Occasionally reporters do make mistakes (they are human).  However, one mistake does not usually result in a listing on the spamcop blocklist.

When you said (in another post) that 'email will look into it', do you mean you have already emailed a spamcop deputy?

And what is the IP address you are concerned about?

Miss Betsy

37914[/snapback]

I have no idea what you are replying to. We don't send mail. I don't know what other post you're referring to.

We are a large ISP. We have thousands of customers. We are trying to get spamcop reports and deal with them. So far, not a single spamcop report has been valid (ie was spam). A large number of them have been obviously not spam (the mailing list example above)

Can you stop re-thinking the question into some specific situation and answer the actual question I asked?

[jrhett]

Hi!

...There are a few SpamCop FAQ (see link, above, labeled "SpamCop FAQ") entries that I believe address your questions:

• Has your email been blocked? (ISP, Mailing List Admin, Advertiser)
  
• How can I be de-listed
  
• I have been falsely and/or maliciously accused of spamming, what can I do?
  
• How do I get in touch with the person who filed the complaint?
  

If anything here still leaves you with a question in your mind, please pop back in here to ask them as follow-ups. Thanks!

37917[/snapback]

A. We aren't blocked so this doesn't apply. I'm trying to find valid spam and enforce our AUP when necessary. You're thinking about this backwards (for our situation)

B. same as A

C. The FAQ in C claims that there is a link in the spam report to dispute it. I have 5 or 6 sitting right in front of me, and not a single one has such a link. If you want, I'd be happy to cut and paste all of their contents into a post here just to prove it.

D. Seeing ####[at]reports.spamcop.net made me assume that it was invalid. If we can just reply, that's one avenue.

[turetzsr]

<snip>

When you said (in another post) that 'email will look into it', do you mean you have already emailed a spamcop deputy?

I have no idea what you are replying to. We don't send mail. I don't know what other post you're referring to.

37935[/snapback]

...Perhaps:

So I'm not getting much more than "we'll look into it" from e-mail so I'm posting this here.

<snip>

37910[/snapback]

Can you stop re-thinking the question into some specific situation and answer the actual question I asked?

37935[/snapback]

...If you want any further help from me (a follow up to your last post, for example), you will issue an apology to Miss Betsy. You are here asking for insight from SpamCop users, so you have no right to be so rude, IMHO.

[jrhett]

...Perhaps:...If you want any further help from me (a follow up to your last post, for example), you will issue an apology to Miss Betsy. You are here asking for insight from SpamCop users, so you have no right to be so rude, IMHO.

She had a right to be snide and condescending to me? She is allowed to reframe it in a condescending manner and use it to ridicule? But my request that she answer the question that I asked is rude?

I'm trying to do my job. This isn't the place for placing jerk-off games, and I don't appreciate this little power play. The point is to get the job done, right? So let's focus on that.

[turetzsr]

She had a right to be snide and condescending to me?  She is allowed to reframe it in a condescending manner and use it to ridicule?

37941[/snapback]

...No, and she wasn't! You may have perceived her answer as such but what you perceive is not relevant. As you wrote, correctly, "The point is to get the job done, right? So let's focus on that."

But my request that she answer the question that I asked is rude?

37941[/snapback]

...You are here asking for help, not Miss Betsy. She gains nothing by helping you; you gain (hopefully) by having us help you. There's no "power play" involved here, you play by my rules if you want my help. Note that I am only one of several people here who can help you and their rules might not be as strict as mine, I'm just fed up with rude behavior from people who have no right to be rude (as opposed to those of us who can help, whose answers might be considered rude but who deserve the benefit of the doubt on that score: a simple "I'm sorry, I don't believe you understand the situation, and here's why" from you would have been sufficient -- "Can you stop re-thinking the question into some specific situation and answer the actual question I asked?" was out of line and I won't accept it -- congratulations, you have been added to the very short list of people whose posts I ignore).

[Wazoo]

I have no idea what you are replying to.  We don't send mail.  I don't know what other post you're referring to.

As I asked in the other Topic "you" (or someone else using your account) started, I find it odd that "you" don't have a clue about the contents of another of "your" Topics.

We are a large ISP.  We have thousands of customers.  We are trying to get spamcop reports and deal with them.   So far, not a single spamcop report has been valid  (ie was spam).  A large number of them have been obviously not spam (the mailing list example above)

No specific data offered in any of your "Topic starting" posts .. just exactly why and how do you expect someone "here" to have any kind of a clue as to who "you" are or "the massive ISP that you are" might actually be identified as??

Can you stop re-thinking the question into some specific situation and answer the actual question I asked?

37935[/snapback]

Generic questions can only be offered generic answers ... you've been provided a number of FAQ items to take a look at, you say you've done that ... yet, apparently overlooked other items like [How to} post a question in the Forum section entry position, the additional How to ask a question links provided in yet another entry titled Start here - before you make your first post .... all placed in order to prevent exactly this type of dialog ....

D.  Seeing ####[at]reports.spamcop.net made me assume that it was invalid.  If we can just reply, that's one avenue.

37936[/snapback]

Well, can't help it when assumptions are made. And I do seem to recollect that this is in fact data found within the FAQ provided here (which may link back to the 'original' FAQ ....???) But you say you've already looked through "the" FAQ (although not stating just which version that may have been)

She had a right to be snide and condescending to me?  She is allowed to reframe it in a condescending manner and use it to ridicule?  But my request that she answer the question that I asked is rude?

I'm trying to do my job.  This isn't the place for placing jerk-off games, and I don't appreciate this little power play.  The point is to get the job done, right?  So let's focus on that.

37941[/snapback]

For the record, I'm the rude, crude lowlife of record here. I've no idea how you could translate Miss Betsy's "non-technical background" attempt at trying to steer you to something as being of a "talking down to you" situation. You've just triggered a whole set of reactions in the part of your activity here.

You will stop opening up miltiple Topics on the same subject area.

You will get back to answering questions asked of you, which would include some data that was not provided by your initial entry here.

You will note the user-to-user notices made at each Forum section entry page.

You will change some of the attitude displayed "here" .... or perhaps follow the suggested scenario of simply not "playing games" here and simply deal with the "paid" SpamCop.net staff via e-mail.

And as there is only the one Topic remaining open that actually has data provided to work with, this one will also be closed.