Avtech Direct

[jrcovert]

Moved out of the Help Forum, [link here].

Many of us have received "offers" from Avtech Direct. Here's the latest one I received:

[spamCop Display]

I get these from this particular spammer all the time since I'm on a number of email lists at GaTech and MIT. (I'm a volunteer at both institutions.) SpamCop properly reported both URLs in the message I received today, but as you know I'm using a mail system that's guaranteed not to modify the message before submission to SpamCop. :-)

Am I too far off topic to discuss this particular spammer, rather than an actual SpamCop issue?

The messages would seem to make it look like this spammer is in full compliance with the [You]CanSpam Act. No obvious spoofing of return address, "ADV:" in the subject, a "working" removal address, a physical postal address. All the right stuff.

BUT the spam is coming from (apparently) co-opted servers, sending HELO messages (at least in the case of the messages sent to MIT) with a fake IP address (which doesn't fool the MIT servers) and a fake header claiming to be that fake MIT IP address with another fake server to try to fool the reporting system (SpamCop isn't fooled by this). THAT _is_ a violation of the [You]CanSpam Act.

Not to mention the fact that the addresses they're sending to could only have been obtained by harvesting or dictionary attacks.

Sometimes I feel like trying to organize the students who have also received these particular spams to each go to a real pay phone and call the 800 number listed in the spam and ask a few legitimate questions about the stuff being sold, and then say "Very interesting, but I would never buy from a spammer." (800 calls from payphones cost the recipient a minimum of fifty cents in addition to whatever rate they're able to get from their phone company.)

/john

[Miss Betsy]

There are people who do that sort of thing. One man filled out all the mortgage requests with bogus information and actually did get a couple of 'real' mortgage companies who answered to whom he explained that spamming was a bad way of getting business.

Others find corporate addresses and try to convince the policy makers that using spam is not a reputable way of doing business.

And there are others who have a way of visiting the web site automatically so many times that it drains their bandwidth.

Many people feel that they do not want to sink to level of the spammer by using abuse to counter abuse. To call merely to make the spammer pay is abuse, IMHO. To call to try to educate the company about how abusive spam is and to warn them that most reasonable people JHD and that there is a substantial number who won't buy anything from a spammer is a different thing. (I won't stay in a Ramada Inn.) To organize a group of students to 'educate' or to 'research' is not abusive.

OTOH, most spammers are already just within the legal limits of being scammers. Harassing them is probably not going to make a whole lot of difference. They simply move on (change the phone number, change the web site).

My $.02 USD

Miss Betsy

[dra007]

/snipOTOH, most spammers are already just within the legal limits of being scammers.  Harassing them is probably not going to make a whole lot of difference.  They simply move on (change the phone number, change the web site).

My $.02 USD

Miss Betsy

17540[/snapback]

Well said, yet I would argue that most spam <<I get>> qualifies as fraud and illegal. Perhaps it is the reason they host their domains in places like China and Brazil where it is more difficult to shut them down or legally pusue them.

[dra007]

Interestingly if spammers cannot cheat you with spam they will try to sell you spammers' lists (one I got today):

Hello,

I have access to several million

consumer and business leads in hundreds

of categories and demographics. Full

data and IP available.

If you would be interested in purchasing

a portion of this invaluable database,

please let me know what categories

would benefit your firm.